[Marlise Flores]

Welcome to the Parents Table! Marlise here, parent of three kiddos, and one of your moderators at our table.

As a parent, we have a unique and important role in raising generations that will follow us. We teach and model what tools and values our children should hold as they navigate the world. We need to be prepared to model the North Star of racial justice as we raise our children. Our intentions need to match our words. Our words need to match our actions. We are accountable for how our actions impact others.

From us, our children learn to be either relational or individualistic, dehumanizing or seeing eye-to-eye, manipulating power or walking in community. Our walk as adults with each other directly impacts how our children interact with others. What tools and behaviors are we passing on? Do we pass on a legacy of power down or a legacy of resilient, communal walking?

Let’s get to know each other as we sit at this virtual table together.

How long have you been in the Lace on Race space?

What crossings have you found lumpy as you’ve progressed through the pinned posts on Facebook (our new Starters forum here)?

Do you have any questions for me, for Lace, or for your fellow walkers at this table?

Discussion

[Miela Gruber]

Hello everyone! So glad to be here with you all! And I am so happy Marlise is here with us-Marlise you’ve already had an effect on me and my kids so many times. I look forward to walking with you all to learn and grow in our families into a different way of being and creating the possibility of culture change with our kids. I have three older kids, and two teens in the house-13 and 15. Most of my struggles have been with the youngest-after raising the other four and having other kids come along for the ride in our house with us too, he’s the one who stumps me. Our family has changed a lot from the last year at Lace on Race. We have grown a lot, gotten more honest, more kind, and more committed to our community and to inner work. My marriage has been changed deeply and how we live is slowly changing too. It’s good to be here with you-so many of the lumps and slosh in the road have to do with these family relations.

Happy new year!

[Vicki van den Eikhof]

Thanks, Marlise, for moderating this group!

I have four children: a son, aged 23; and three daughters, aged 20, 18, and 15. We live in an area that is predominately white, with a significant community of Hispanic/Latinx folks and a much smaller community of Black folks.

I joined LoR after the George Floyd murder, when I saw it in one of those now-infamous lists that came out about what white people could do to fight racism. I had no idea what I was getting into, but it has been so meaningful-I wouldn’t change it. I’m so glad that I found LoR when I did because my oldest daughter got caught up in the very active and visible aspects of things-all the marches, protests, etc., but she was also exhibiting some of the very behaviors that Lace warns about (especially with white progressive women)-showing up for the protests with lots of emotion, then disengaging from the work. Because of my involvement here, I’ve been able to keep her a little more engaged in the ongoing and internal work, as well as the protests and marches.

When my kids were younger, I didn’t really take an active approach to anti-racism, but I am now.

[Shannon Brescher Shea]

It’s so great to hear about how you’re using your work in Lace on Race with your daughter and helping her move forward in her racial justice journey. As a mom of younger kids, I wonder what effect it will have on them in the long run and how I can prepare them for the long-haul.

[Christina Sonas]

Hi everyone! I have three kids, 24, 21, 15. I joined LOR in late May; I moved up my search for a BIPOC-led antiracism community after George Floyd was murdered by the police. Being a part of this community has really charged my efforts to reduce and repair white harm to Black and brown people, starting with my very first course correction away from thinking of antiracism as self-improvement. I look forward to walking with others at this “table” to work through keeping our praxis strong in our parenting. Happy New Year!

[Marlise Flores]

I am thrilled to be here with you all. My three kiddos are 5 yr, 3 yr, and 7 mo.

Where I’ve found lumpy crossings is realizing the way I was raised to treat children (by how adults treated me) was absolutely a power down stance. I see a strong connection to the ways I interact, listen to, and lead my children and the way they relate to others, especially in how they view their agency and resiliency when it comes to being accountable to community and always aware of injustice. Right now, as they are so small, their biggest encounter with injustice is with me as a parent. The tools Lace talks about so much are front and center in daily lessons. Emotional regulation, eye to eye, follow through, etc.

Due to age, now I am starting to introduce topics that would typically fall under education, but I am observing how these conversations fall flat or the lessons are missed if those grounding tools have yet to be taught well.

What steps are you taking to dig into those deeper layers with your children? Have your reflected on your own upbringing and how that laid the groundwork for toxic power down dynamics or white victimhood+white benevolence/goodness?

[Shannon Brescher Shea]

Figuring out how to not take that “power down” stance has been absolutely essential for our family. Our older son is neurodivergent in a way that makes him very emotionally intense and tend to reject authority. Finding ways to help guide him to see the bigger picture of his actions and be guided by his sense of justice and kindness rather than because someone told him to do something has been key in helping him figure out what is right and wrong.

[Emily Holzknecht]

Hi everyone, I’m Emily. I’m the parent of two school-age children. Our children go to Spanish immersion school where at least half the children are brown. In the middle school grades most of the children are brown. The teachers come from many different Spanish-speaking countries and many are brown, Black or indigenous. I have always tried to talk with my children about racial justice and the school has some racial justice elements to it that are much stronger than I ever had in school, but even with what we have been doing, I know it’s not enough.

I have been walking with Lace on Race for about half a year. When I started walking, doing the work out loud was something I realized I was shying away from. That combined with trying to rid myself of the white supremacist beliefs that there is one right way and that people’s knowledge gives them value is a difficult path for me to navigate. It is particularly challenging for me when I encounter someone else who is seeing through the “one right way” and “knowledge = value” lens and where I felt I was finding solid ground with doing the work out loud without the white supremacy creating in, I once again feel wobbly and unsure as to whether I really was navigating well. This isn’t just related to parenting, but there is a parenting component in there and it’s what came out in response to Marlise’s questions. I am particularly looking forward to this seating.

My field is early childhood education with a focus on what could be called seeing children eye to eye, and in many ways I was pretty strong with parenting in a way that was not primarily power down in the early years. My older child who is almost 10 needs me to grow with her to the next stage of her development though and for me to be able to pass down more sophisticated tools to her.

[Charolette Letourneau]

Hi there! My kiddos are 6 and 3. I definitely agree with Marlise about the traditional way of raising children being a top-down, power-over model. In fact, I believe this is where a lot of the issues with holding relationship with others start, because we are not raised by people who see eye to eye with us. I live in Minnesota, so a lot of the recent issues have been very much close to home for me, in many senses of the word. I started to seek out ways to fight racism after George Floyd was murdered in my city. I’m sorry it took me so long. I have been doing more reading and listening. I found Lace on Race in October.

I’ll admit that I’ve been struggling emotionally this past year. My marriage has been filled with lumpy crossings. I try very hard not to slosh. I intend to try to get into therapy this year to do the deep work that will make me safer for Black and brown people. I’m glad to be walking with you all here.

[Alei Delgadillo]

As a woman who was also raised in the Midwest – I feel it. It’s everywhere and never talked about, it’s just life. And it takes so long to shake us out of it and stop with the excuses and the lies and the justifications and just acknowledge racism for what it is. And then comes the dawning realization of horror that we have been perpetuating it with our silence and nods and that everyone around us is drinking the koolaid and think we’re the ones who have lost it. It’s suuuuuuper fun.

[Rhonda Freeman]

Good morning! My ‘How to be an anti-racist’ activities got serious last January when a friend and fellow member of the Non-violent communication (NVC) community invited me to a course she was was co-facilitating for white people. It escalated through the reading I was doing and then the young people in my cohousing community agreed to start a social activist task force since they were home from school. Maybe it is my engineering background, but I have found/find myself being pretty methodical: participating in this space, taking several courses, and committing to purchasing from black owned businesses. I also want to express my gratitude for the Lace and the team being forward looking with this new format. I am coming to believe that Facebook and other spaces curated/led by white people are adding to the harm to black and brown people and I am glad to support moving away from those spaces whenever we possibly can.

I am the mother of a 21 year old transgender daughter. We talk a lot about what she considers the ultimate violence done to transwomen of color. Its pretty big. While I don’t have any little kids living with me right now. I have lots of children in my cohousing community and I am looking very much forward to walking with all of you here.

[Rhonda Freeman]

Marlise: I forgot to ask my question. Are we allowed to start new discussions? I have something specific on my mind for this group. Should we reach out to you privately in some way if we have a topic?

[Christina Sonas]

Only the group moderators have “new discussion” privileges. I believe you can put something into the feed on the group landing page, though.

[Rhonda Freeman]

Thanks, Christina. I appreciate the clarifiation.

[Marlise Flores]

Rhonda, the reason behind the setup is to keep the North Star in focus. Often, we as white people want to hone in on topical conversation. “Answer this complicated situation for me.” “I need personal consulting with an issue but am not going to contribute for the level of consulting I actually need.” Etc. There might be a subject introduced that is topical, but the goal is always to dig out the bits of wisdom to apply regardless of the situation. There is also a need to introduce topics as the group is ready for them, and not before. We absolutely can do harm as white people if we are jumping into discussions without getting the basics down.

[Rhonda Freeman]

Please let me know if I wobbled with my sharing below about the situation in Loudon County. Wanting to follow the guidelines and engage in a way that supports the North Star.

[Alei Delgadillo]

Hello! My name is Alei and I am *a* mom of three kiddos. Okay, two kiddos and a teen that is entirely beyond me. The younger two are mine biologically – an almost 5 year old girl and a 6 year old boy. The older one, a 14 yr old boy, is mine via “step” parenting with his mother.

I was introduced to Lace on Race in either early 2019 or late 2018 – and lurked for almost a year. I quickly got overwhelmed by the content, blamed it on being frustrated by facebook, and subsequently have not participated even a single iota in well over a year.

I found myself realizing just how much work I need when listening to Lace’s opening video in Guidelines and trying to mentally rewrite the very ethos she was sharing. I IMMEDIATELY tried to be more comfortable with the space by thinking, “Well sure most of the harm is perpetuated by white people but aren’t there others who cause harm too?” and “Black and brown people experience harm but they are not the only ones.” Only because of my small amount of time here over a year ago was I even able to recognize the absolute whiteness of such sentiments and recommit to doing *bleeping* better.

Especially because of my kids. I do not want them to ingest whiteness the same way I did, nor wait 30 years to even realize I was causing harm, let alone doing something about it. They will, most likely, always have to actively mitigate the harm they cause with their whiteness, but they can have me to help them instead of trying to figure it out on their own, starting from scratch, or worse – and more likely being from a progressive and non heteronormative family – think they are helping when they are actually causing even more harm.

So to be clear, my lumpiness is 100% bailing when things get uncomfortable and inconvenient. I also tend to default to humor to keep people from being mad at me (or at the very least reducing their displeasure and therefore reducing my feelings of failure) and so I’m also doing my damndest to not do that in this space. My feelings are not the goal.

[Amanda Swartfager]

I have two young daughters and I’ve been sharing the things I’m learning here with them. We’ve been reading books created by Black and brown authors. We’ve also made it a point to identify problematic stereotypes and white supremacy presented in ads, books, shows, and movies created by white people. We always start with asking questions like, who created this? Why? Who is left out? They are saving and engaging financially with Black activists, and I’m reinforcing the need to always lead with the intent to lessen harm caused to Black and brown communities, by white people and the system of white supremacy. I’m looking forward to hearing about and learning from other families.

[Amanda Swartfager]

I realized I wrote a lot about what my family is doing and not about my parenting history or any lumpy crossings. We started with a positive parenting style using nonviolent communication. This was and still is difficult for me, as my natural inclination is to buckle down and take care of myself first. I’ve learned that is not helpful to anyone and is nowhere near seeing eye to eye. My lumpy crossings are mostly related to managing states of overwhelm. When I started walking here, I found myself shutting down with all the realizations that were happening regarding ways I was hurting others and the systems of oppression I contribute to that were created on purpose to harm Black and brown people and elevate whiteness. When I’m overwhelmed, I don’t fly, but freeze. I have to work at being resilient enough that I can give myself the needed time to process and calm, and then head back into the information and relational ethics presented here without using overwhelm as an excuse to stay frozen well beyond my melting point.

[Leah Gallo]

Hi Amanda, I too have this ‘freeze’ response when overwhelmed. Being in this space has made me more aware of it, though, and now I can generally acknowledge it’s what I’m doing, and stop myself from retreating. It also helps when I shift my focus from my own overwhelm to the stakes of my withdrawl (Black lives) rather than what I used to tell myself which was ‘it doesn’t really matter’ as if my actions only affected my life (one of the tricks of white supremacy, I think). Shifting my focus has helped me. I look forward to walking with you.

[Amanda Swartfager]

Hi, Leah! What you’ve said is so true. I’m learning to uncenter myself and the difference between acknowledging experiences that may influence me for better or worse, and actual egocentrism. Keeping the north star in mind is the best way to do this, as you say.

[Rebecca McClinton]

Hi there! Glad to be walking with you here! I’m a foster parent, no bio kiddos. We’ve had mainly teens, one at a time over the last 5.5 years.

Each kiddo comes to us from a completely different place/background/trauma history, most typically coming to us from group homes. We’ve had mainly white kiddos though I’m certain that won’t always be the case because the number of BIPOC kiddos taken is much higher (disturbing). Im kind of petrified about messing up when that time comes.

I’m constantly alarmed with how messed up the foster care system is and how much of it is a product of white supremacy, and I don’t even know the half of it yet. I also have responsibility to address that.

Sometimes kids come with some alarming racial biases, racist language and threats, and it’s been hard to not be reactive in unhelpful ways in those times as we work to determine those origins (usually offending from the victim position, which I also tend to do from my own growing up experiences). I look forward to journeying with and learning from you all here. ?

[Konstanze Weltersbach]

Hi everybody!

This is an exciting new place!

I have to kids with my Black US-American husband (I’m white and German/Swiss). We live in one of the most diverse areas in the biggest town in Switzerland – which is very relative – so our kids wouldn’t be the only Black children around. School has been a challenge.

My older child (11) as the anxious almost-Teen is in the middle of her awakening phase when it comes to her Blackness and gender-related issues, while the younger one (7) so far is quite comfortable with his caring, pink and glitter loving, beyblade battling, tree climbing self. Both need very different parenting and have from the time they were born.

I’ve been at LoR for about 6 months. Generally I’m not one for sitting still – I’m a librarian (working almost full time) and at home I do a lot of crafts like cross stich, and just started my first diy miniature house kit (a library of course). If there’s something new to try I’m your woman.

[Christin Spoolstra]

Our first kid is due in about 2 months, so I’m anxiously looking to learn from all of you here.

I’ve been in LoR about two years and have had several lumpy crossings along the way through which I have been held and pushed. The one which stands out most to me in terms of parenting have been discussions about choosing schools and how choosing the “best” for my child can equate with choosing harm for other children. So I’ve been aligning my approach to parenthood to be community and North Star oriented. I recognize that’s easy to say while she’s still cooking in the oven, but my partner and I continue to have conversations to plan for how to carry that out.

Our daughter will be mixed race with two citizenships, so a lot of our planning has been centered upon how to raise her to value both of her heritages and knowing the challenges she will face with being an outsider in both of them.

[Vanessa Chardos (she/her/hers)]

Christin, congrats on your sweet babe to be! I spent a great chunk of my son’s life with that mentality and after several years in charter schools which are deeply entrenched in privilege, we changed the conversation as we realized how damaging this self centered mentality was and switched to our local public school. This has been a huge lumpy crossing for me as a parent and been a great reminder to hold that awareness with my younger two.

[Christin Spoolstra]

Thanks for sharing your experience, Vanessa! How did you approach conversations with your children about that switch to public schooling?

[Vanessa Chardos (she/her/hers)]

Thank you Marlise for leading this group! I’m grateful to have this opportunity to connect with other parents.

I am Vanessa and mother to a 13 yo boy and 19m twin toddler girls. I started talking to my son about racism and white supremacy when he was about 5. We have regular discussions around those topics, but I only started to closely evaluate the ways my parenting perpetuated white supremacy this year when he really hit puberty. We kept getting tangled in power struggles that I often left disheartened and exhausted and one day it hit me that while I had been trying to identify the ws systems within myself, I missed this piece. So we continue to shift the dance that has become teenagedom.

I spent 15 years in early childhood education and K/1 prior to my twins being born. In reflection, I was much better about seeing eye to eye with my students than I have been as a parent.

[Emily Holzknecht]

Hi Vanessa, I relate to the seeing eye to eye better with students than with my own children. I thought teaching twos would have prepared me, but I hadn’t done the internal work and my bucket sloshed so much with my first, prompting me to do a lot more of said internal work, and still it can be hard. Parallels to the internal work of racial justice!

[Rhonda Freeman]

I appreciate the real worlds we are all living in and navigating with our children and the children in our community. I work in the county where a young man of color re-posted a video of a white student using a racial slur – a few years after she originally posted it – making it clear that this was something he experienced on a regular basis. There is much discussion in the community of the repercussions that she faced and whether or not they were ‘fair’. I am clear that I support the young man standing up for himself and I am clear that while the young woman ‘lost’ her acceptance to a college where she was going to be on the cheerleading squad, she did not lose her white privilege (her home, her ability to get an education, etc.). It also brought to light real problems that need to be addressed by the administration. I have voiced this perspective in my white circles and received a lot of backlash. I find myself hoping that I would/will hold my child to account should I see racist behaviour.

[Marlise Flores]

Rhonda, are you feeling some dissonance about the backlash you received? What was your response when you got pushback?

[Rhonda Freeman]

My clench is how hard to ‘push it’. I was told that ‘she should not be called to account for something she did years ago’. that ‘it wasn’t fair that she was punished for something lots of others do, too.’. I simply stated that I was inspired that the young man demonstrated to people in power (adults, the administration, his peers) that his experience in highschool was racist and that she may have had some consequences but the consequences did not compare with black and brown people of color who risk their lives when leaving their homes each day. She still has a roof over her head, food on the table, and access to an education. At that point, no one responded…My clench is that I handled it ‘wrong’. Calling people out rather than in.

[Leah Gallo]

Hello, everyone, and thank you, Marlise, for moderating! I have two kids, 6 and 2. I’ve been at LoR since June. I feel I have had many small lumpy crossings but no big ones yet. My greatest struggle is currently trying to manage my time in a way that feels I give enough to both my family and this work. I absolutely realise how vital the work is here, especially as it relates to parenting. But I often wonder, Marlise, if you have tips for managing to parent tiny humans while still give your all to this work (and a relationship and work and whatever else you have going on).

I am still inculcating the relational, eye to eye doesn’t come naturally to me, and I realise I’m passing on top down power dynamics to my kids, and am working with my 6yo especially right now on being eye to eye, and especially on having accountability. I have started talking to my 6yo when he was 5 about skin color and racism. But it is definitely something I’m keen to learn more about (and how to do better) in service to our North Star. I look forward to our discussions here.

[Marlise Flores]

Oof. I am honestly still struggling on that balance. Parenting littles is a time consuming, all body demanding task. I do notice that my frustrations in that balancing act usually revolve around me wanting to remain “the best” at what I do, struggling with giving and receiving grace, and accepting repurcussons for choices regarding time spent. I catch myself trying to box off parts of my life. “Oh, anti racism and LoR is a separate space from parenting or being with my partner.” That’s not actually true though, or it shouldn’t be. There are seasons where I truly cannot be as involved in this community and others because of the kids (hello teething 7 mo old), but if I’ve taken the time to be KNOWN then this comes as no surprise to those I walk with. I wonder how often my feeling of overwhelm is due to anticipating those season while not investing when I can to know and be known.

[Leah Gallo]

I don’t see the work as separate, per se, but the internal interrogation and computer time is not something I can share with my little ones (as they get older that may change). Perhaps I will get quicker at this. I think you are right – that it comes back to being seen, to the relational. To not using truth as an excuse to give ourselves more grace than we need (or deserve). I also appreciate the idea of wanting to remain “the best.” Ouch. That has landed. Thank you for your insight.

[Jennifer Epstein]

I’m a parent to two children, ages 3.5 and 6. I’ve been at Lace on Race for about three months.

The pinned posts haven’t really been the lumpy parts, but that’s likely also because I have only scratched the surface of them and I have been more involved in the real-time conversations. In there, it’s been more lumpy than not because it’s been unique in how much self-searching I’ve felt accountable to do.

I am a super lumpy parent. Turns out I have less patience than a person in my situation really needs. I try, and struggle, to keep an “enough” mindset with all that needs to be done, and that must be prioritized above what I’d like to be doing.

In our house we are all white. My husband and I talk about race and racism a fair amount with our children, and I also know that we have a long way to go toward living out our values and modeling them for our kids. I recently read a book that explained that children comprehend at a very young age the differences between what they are told about race and what they see acted out day to day by those they trust. So we work against that, but it does feel quite daunting because of the pervasiveness and strength of racist structures.

[Robin Van Haste]

Hi, all! I have an 11 yo boy and an 8 yo girl. I’ve probably been lurking for about 6 months or so, but I’m trying to engage. I grew up with the idea that racism is wrong, but with little awareness that it still exists, that it is built into the fabric of our country, and that we’re participating in it. I’m disturbed to see that my children are learning the same sanitized version of American history in school that I learned.

The lumpy bit for me is engagement. I’m struggling to process all of this, see my role in it, and respond… not just with agreement, but action. I have to keep at it, both to reduce the harm that I cause, and to teach my children better than I was taught.

[Jennifer Epstein]

Another reply to activate the email notification feature 🙂

[Catherine Seaver]

Hello everyone! This space is so exciting. Thank you Marlise for moderating!

I have two kiddos – a 6 year old and 8 year old. Online schooling (something we’ve been doing in Seattle since September) is demanding a lot of me lately but I’ve noticed some changes/growth this week as we adjust to being “back in class” which for us right now is being on Zoom from 8:30-2:30 with a few breaks. My pivot to race is that we are frequently talking about how we need to do hard things. And how to plan for the things that will be difficult. So learning to self-regulate so we can make safe and kind choices has been crucial for my kids. Talking about making choices that care for all our community is something we do a lot. I’m still learning how to introduce topics and history in age-appropriate ways, and am grateful for this space to talk more about specifics.

I’ve definitely been aware of the ways my own childhood made parenting simply a repetition of white supremacy/top-down power structure and abuse. When my two kiddos were very small I was mostly alone as my husband’s work dramatically changed and I was barely sleeping. The demands of that time revealed just how poorly I knew how to live/act the things I value. So I’ve been seeking out support and new tools and new language. I think that what drew me so powerfully to Lace on Race (I joined in June of 2020) is the insistence to go deep, mind our slosh and pay attention to walking while being safe for Black and Brown people. The role of deep love in this place made Lace’s words and wisdom resonate more fully. Loving myself in the midst of my messiness and still walking forward has been key to change in all parts of my life.

[Jen Scaggs]

Hi! I have been following/reading LoR on Facebook since the spring, but too nervous to actually engage. The expectations of the space seemed so intimidating, but I didn’t want to give up completely, so I was a lurker. I’ve been reading and trying to educate myself with tons of books on anti-racism, sharing the books on Facebook, but struggling to take the next step. When I saw the cafe, I decided it was time.

<font face=”inherit”>I have two kids, 12 and 7 years old. We are homeschoolers (not just for the pandemic) and I try to choose books to read with them about racism and include diverse history and literature books in their curriculum, but I haven’t gone much further than reading with them (other than some basic conversations surrounding what we read). I would like to find </font>ways to discuss and model anti-racism with my kids.

Since I’m just starting here, there haven’t been any lumpy crossings yet, other than the huge lump of getting myself started. I’ve had a lumpy crossing with a relative about one of the books I shared on Facebook, in which I got very defensive and worked up, then basically gave up on it. I tend to avoid conflict at all costs, especially with relatives, so that’s something I need to work on.

[Marlise Flores]

Jenn, I am glad you are here. For me, I am quickly learning that my behaviors (like conflict avoidance) are part of how racism is perpetuated. My children learn those behaviors from me, and when they are in a situation to choose preservation and personal power over speaking up, they will model what they’ve seen me model, even in ways that might not seem overtly connected to racism. Knowing about racism doesn’t stop us as white people from using behaviors that still protect our power, our resources, and our positions. I look forward to conversations with you as we all learn how to navigate anti racism with better tools.

[Shannon Brescher Shea]

Hello! Thank you for the introduction and your work at Lace on Race. I’m a mom to an almost-five year old and a seven year old. We’ve worked to be anti-racist since they were toddlers and have informed them of the efforts we take as adults.

I’ve personally been in the Lace on Race space since near the beginning – summer 2018, I think? In terms of lumpy crossings, I think I’ve struggled the most with balancing a sense of urgency and getting burnt out with a sense of consistency. I want to do so much but also know that’s both impossible and an attitude that’s rooted in white supremacist notions of saviourism and independence (rather than interdependence).

[Author]

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